Investing And Farming For Gold
Posted on July 16th, 2009 by Lawbringer under Alchemy, Auction House, Death Knights, Economics, Efficiency Tips, Exploits, Gathering Professions, General Tips, Gold Building, Gold Farming, Herbalism, Leatherworking, Low Level, Mining, Skinning, Supply And Demand, Trade Skills, World of Warcraft, WotLK, tailoringWhen To Buy, When To Sell – And When To Farm?
Farming is not something we do. It takes a perfect storm of circumstances to make me even think about it. But there are a couple of situations that came up recently that basically required doing a little bit of actually getting my hands dirty.
Well, OK, they weren’t my hands, but someone did some farming. It pointed out that there is a really good way to tell when there is a huge hole in the market where supply is way below demand. The good part is that it’s pretty easy to spot since the holes are HUGE on many servers.
In the end I didn’t actually do any farming at all, but I have some folks around the guild and the family that tend to miss the finer points of auction house Domination, but they understand that if they go get a few stacks of something they can get paid – by me.
The guy who has the gold makes the rules. It’s been that way ever since the Magna Carta. That one document took most of the power away from those born into power by shifting the money (and therefore the power) to those who had some cash. Enough with the history lesson, let’s get on to how you can take advantage of this with the whole force of more than 150 years of history behind you.
Normally we just buy low and sell high. It works best when you spread your offerings (and by default, purchases) out over a LOT of different types of things. By far my favorite is mats. Mats make up the majority of the profitable items anyway and only a pro should deal with Items – the market for those things is just too volatile.
When it comes to mats you are making a grave mistake if you try to deal too much with Northrend stuff. I know this sounds counter-intuitive, but think about it for a minute. Most folks who farm are going to do so at level 80. This means that when enough of them are out there herbing and mining Sholazar that there is going to be a huge influx of high end mats into the market, thereby depressing the prices for those items.
Everyone else is rushing to GET to level 80 and not stopping to farm along the way. You see, the way you know exactly what to sell is to project what everyone in the market is doing and then do whatever they are not doing. Everyone wants 25 stacks of Titanium ore right now before the patch. When the patch hits, prices will triple, but there will be soooooo much of it around that it will drop again rather sharply once all the Jewelcrafters get sick of prospecting at 15 gold a turn for those new rare epic gems (that won’t hold a price either if you know anything about the gems market).
So – what WE do to make gold hand over fist day in and day out without having to rely on hoarding and market spikes is very simple. Instead of Titanium (which you think everyone wants) you need to control the Mithril and Thorium markets. Instead of Arctic fur, you need to make sure you have a stranglehold on the Medium and light leather markets.
You see, all those guys leveling new toons and alts skip trade skills on the way to 80 (almost everyone does). Then, when they hit 80 they want to powerlevel two (or even four if you count cooking and first aid) trade skills all the way to 400+ in a few hours. This is where you get rich. Not on Titanium, not on Lichbloom, not on Borean leathers – it’s the low level stuff that has the best supply/demand ratio.
In other words, the amount of time it takes to get those things compared to the profit margin for selling them is often higher than the Northrend mats. You can get 20 stacks of light leather in the time it takes to get 5 or 10 heavy Borean. Because listing fees for low level mats are almost nothing, you can post them over and over again for almost any price you like and they WILL SELL.
These holes in the supply end of your market become apparent when YOU try to do what everyone ELSE is doing. I was working up Alchemy, Tailoring and Leatherworking on my DK bankers last week and there were 36 light leather and 13 Stranglekelp on the AH. That was all there was, and I needed maybe five or ten times that much. Since I have a lot of gold I could care less what the prices were, I would have bought them all and not even thought twice about it.
You see, there is no such thing as a “fair price.” Fair is in the eye of the beholder. When I want to powerlevel a profession I’ll pay 20 gold a stack for peacebloom if that’s all there is. It will still cost me a lot less gold if I pay Northrend mat prices for starting area mats because it requires so much less to get skill points out of that stuff.
If YOU don’t like the high prices for entry level stuff go farm some yourself. Use what you need and sell the rest – probably to me (and I’ll jack the price up to where supply equals demand and make the bucks off of your effort). That’s how a free market works.
If you know how people want to behave or how they ARE behaving in relationship to any market you can find what their need is and fill it. This situation showed me that there was a HUGE need for light leather, medium leather, Mithril, Thorium, and about a half dozen other things. It became obvious that there was no one on the server farming mats between the levels of 15-50, but hundreds of guys supplying Northrend stuff. Low supply and steady demand (demand for mats is almost always steady) means big profits if you can fill the gaps.
I still didn’t farm, but I told a few people I would pay them twice the market rate for every stack they could get their hands on. Now the AH has just enough mats at a price I set that I make far more out of the low end mats. And since I control the supply, I set the price. Every now and again some nut posts a few stacks at doofy prices and I happily buy him out and pop them right back up at the proper price.
The proper price is always the price where the supply curve meets the demand curve and establishes an equilibrium.
Item level has absolutely nothing to do with it. If there are 400 stacks of Titanium and a demand for 200, the price is at least two times too high. If there are 2 stacks of Liferoot and demand for 20 stacks, the price is 10 times too low. It makes no difference if the price for Earthroot eventually passes that of the price for the Titanium. Supply above demand lowers prices, demand above supply raises them.
So look for these types of things in your market, and be sure you’re looking in the right spots. If you must farm, look for the things most people skip (normally in the 150-300 skill range in most gathering professions) and pretty soon you’ll be raking it in with both hands and just laughing when everyone else is taking a beating on those highly volatile high end mats – while you vacation in Stranglethorn off your earnings from the lowbie stuff.

















Good points, all… well, most.
Pardon the pickiness, but the Magna Carta was signed almost 700 years ago, not 150. (For those of you just tuning in, the big debate in the U.S. about haebeas corpus and unlawful imprisonment is all based in the Magna Carta.)
And your comment about “That one document took most of the power away from those born into power by shifting the money (and therefore the power) to those who had some cash” is a wee bit confusing, unless “cash” and “money” are different things.
So: Your posts about WoW-style economics are great — keep those up.
Your posts about history need a little work, though.
- Abscond
Tru dat – sigh Google. The REAL figure should have been 794 years. Almost 800 years of history. And, um, cash and money are really the same thing in effect. Liquid assets. Regardless of how those things are defined in terms of monetary terminology. In 1215 – when the Magna Carta was signed, it most certainly was based on money as defined by a metalic standard such as gold.
With most monetary systems being based on something other than a gold standard these days (a fiat [or representative or commodity] system such as in the US since Aug 15th, 1971 after the Bretton-Woods agreements expired; which had set international currency to the standard of the Dollar [big shocker there]) there is great debate on the use of fiat money in general.
Fiat currency systems allow Government (or any controlling entity) to control the value of the currency in the market by manipulating supply. (In essence every dollar [or any other currency for that matter] printed ends up putting more than 10 dollars into circulation through a complicated process in fractional reserve banking).
Our point with the Magna Carta was only meant to say that it was the first time in world history where the subjects (although nobles by birth = barons) initiated legal action against a monarchy (King John of England, theretofore untouchable) to protect certain rights as they pertained to certain activities. Basically they sued Jimmy to keep his hands out of their pockets ad infinitum.
It didn’t really stick, of course. If you REALLY follow history the only thing the MC really did was prove that the King (or any other ruling entity) was only in such a position because OF the law, not ABOVE the law. The “Declaration of Independence” calls on such by saying :
“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.”
So I guess you are quibbling with me about the terms cash and money. I suppose I should have been more clear about whether I meant liquid or fixed assets, but it still hardly negates the issue of the Magna Carta being a turning point in the “He who has the gold makes the rules” issue.
All GREAT fortunes in world history have either been MADE or HELD in the form of Real Estate. Which, of course, is not liquid. So I should, perhaps, have said ‘wealth’ in general instead of cash or money (especially since ‘money’ is such a relatively difficult term to define). So while I appologize for the indescrepancy in relation to the definitions of the wording of the thesis, it hardly negates the point of the intention of the argument. Next time I will be sure to be more precise with my verbiage.
You know, you have exactly the mindset of an investment banker, hedge fund manager or even a day trader. Why not put some of your time and energy into playing the stock market? It’s not all that different than working the WoW AH, and you could come out of it filthy rich (with real money, that is).
Just kick me back 1% of your profits for the suggestion, and we’ll call it even.
Just tossing this out there – but the Outlands (or DK Ville) is pretty empty now days. I mine Fel Iron, nodes are friggin Everywhere in HFP. then I go through the portal and hit Thorium and Mithril. you can Relly add up the stacks Fast in an hour.
speaking of ore – always keep an eye out for the bars vs. Ore costs. I have made Good Easy coin with lower ores where the Bars sell really well for BS and Engineering power levelers. Ill buy a ton of ore, smelt and post them at twice the ore price.
Great suggestion, I’m going to try it out this weekend.
Okay, this may sound like a noob question, but how do you determine demand? I mean, supply is easy enough to determine; just look at what’ available on the AH. However, how can you determine what the demand is for anything?
Simple: Post 3 auctions.
1 undercuting, 1 in the middle, 1 higher than all the other auctions for 48 hours.
If only the first sells, the demand is low
if the second sells, demand is good for profit
if the third sells, then chances are, demand is high.
IF all 3 sell within 12 hours, then post a 4th auction at double the price of the third, if that sells, then demand is there.
at least thats what ive done.
You can determine supply by searching for mats like cloth, or leather, or dusts, or herbs, and if you don’t see many posted my guess would be supply is down so demand should be up. Like in the example above there was only a few stacks of medium leather… or i could be way off.
While your at it, you could also post about my other source of income, level 10-60 green armor and weapons
after 60 its better to just DE items.
if you think, and if you read this article, you’ll realize why.
The thing is with those starters mats, like peacebloom, light/medium leathers, and ores, when you try to “Dominate” this market, it is easily to be undercutted by someone else. Like someone would see like “wow, peacebloom for 15g a stack, Lemme farm for 2 or 3 stacks and undercut it by 14g 99s.
I keep seeing ppl undercutting me with 1-2 stacks with a difference of +/- 1g.
And than this question pops up in my head :”I will gain nothing for buying those 2 stacks, perhaps even lose money, so that means I have to wait for a lazy git who buys the first 2 stacks before I gonna make profit from my next stacks – but before this will happen, maybe another guy will be about to undercut me again”
So my question is… should I keep paying out those who undercuts me?
Or should I simply wait till the other 2 stacks or sold?
But the tricky bit of those starters goods is… they can be easily obtained by level 5′ish/10′ish, and them buggers cuts me for 1 gold.
i really could use some suggestions here,
thank you in advantage>Ell
If those 2 stacks that undercut your price are still sitting there, then the demand is not high enough for what your selling.
Absolutely NO bear flanks on AH last night. Or juicy bear anus or whatever the recipe is. I had to farm. For over an hour. I almost cried and spammed guild chat about how much I hated it, but I got what I needed. So, Lawbringer, you are correct. Between 150-300 you can murder folks with pricing those low level mats on the AH for a tidy profit. Have fun out there folks. Farming sucks unless you like it. I sure don’t.
So, assuming someone does end up farming for stuff; what’s to stop them from just posting the stuff at a really high price themselves, instead of selling the stuff to you at “double market price”?
Honestly, if you can sell medium leather for 80g a stack, then that IS the market price. Offering to buy it from people who go out and farm for 20g a stack would only work if you (and they) believed that you can sell identical goods for higher prices than they can. Which is insane, unless they don’t know the AH exists.
All I know is this. Whne it comes to the AH I listen to Lawbringer. It may not always make sense but it always works out that Imake a profit even it is not the profit I hoped for. I have not purchased the AH guide as of yet. Fromt eh few small pieces of information they have supplied here I have a dedicated banker toon that was setting there doing nothing at level 30 because i did not like a warrior after I started one. His gold has gone from nearly 0 per day to 85 per day in just a few weeks. If I was to buy yhte guide who knows where it would be per day.
Thanks for the tips Lawbringer, Gavin, and the rest of the staff.
Derisaan 80 Dranie Hunter
Kirin Tor Realm
Chosen Few Guild